Doing Good for Non-Profit Organizations and Beyond

Whether you work in the for-profit world or the non-profit sector, there are a lot of truths involved in how you run your organization and the people that you have on your team.

In this episode, I sit down with Ryan Hyman and we talk about some of the ways that non-profit organizations function and some interesting stories of boards that sometimes may not connect the dots and those that get the point and can find ways to connect with their constituents – donors/investors, community leaders and more.

About Ryan: Ryan Hyman was born in South Africa but has now lived in the New York area, except for a five-year stint on the West Coast, for most of his life. After graduating college, Ryan embarked on the beginning of his not-for-profit journey, before being wooed away to the world of commercial real estate finance for a decade. But the not-for-profit world kept whispering in his ear, “come back, come back!” So Ryan returned to the not-for-profit world where he created the first development department at a local school and has occupied several positions building his skills in the fundraising realm. In 2016, Ryan created rh Strategic as a side gig to help organizations that approached him for help on occasion. Today, rh Strategic helps diverse not-for-profit clients across the United States as a full-service consulting firm.

Connect with Ryan on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, YouTube, and on the web at http://www.rhstrategic.net

Transcript (auto-generated; may contain errors):

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Jennifer Glass: Hello and welcome to another episode of MOJO: The Meaning of Life and Business.

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Jennifer Glass: for a lot of people. The nonprofit world

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Jennifer Glass: is one of those things that you either love

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Jennifer Glass: or you can’t stand.

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Jennifer Glass: It depends on. Do you work as a fundraiser?

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Jennifer Glass: Were you a fundraiser

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Jennifer Glass: for you, one of those people that are constantly being bombarded for donations.

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Jennifer Glass: But at the end of the day, though there is so much that can be done in the nonprofit space

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Jennifer Glass: people that are fundraisers

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Jennifer Glass: like me myself in the past life. I was a professional fundraiser, and i’m still involved in a lot of nonprofit organizations.

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Jennifer Glass: and my guest, who is a consultant

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Jennifer Glass: to a lot of non-profit organizations.

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Jennifer Glass: and has been involved in the same role as well as a fundraiser.

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Jennifer Glass: But when we talk about fundraising and the nonprofit world. There are so many things that are involved.

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Jennifer Glass: and so many intricacies about the nonprofit space

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Jennifer Glass: that really allows us to explore significantly more about the nonprofit world.

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Jennifer Glass: and how doing good can actually make a lot of difference.

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Jennifer Glass: And so, before I bring my guest on, let me tell you a little bit about him.

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Jennifer Glass: Ryan Hyman was born in South Africa.

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Jennifer Glass: but has now lived in the New York area, except for 5 years stint on the west coast for most of his life.

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Jennifer Glass: After graduating from college, Ryan embarked on the beginning of his not for profit journey before being wooed away to the world of commercial real estate finance for a decade.

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Jennifer Glass: But the nonprofit world kept whispering in his ear.

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Jennifer Glass: Come back!

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Jennifer Glass: So Ryan returned to the not for Profit World, where he created the first Development Department at a local school, and has occupied several positions, building his skills in the fundraising realm in 2016. Ryan created rH Strategic

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Jennifer Glass: as a side gate to help organizations that approached him for help on occasion. Today, rH Strategic helps diverse not for profit clients across the United States as a full service consulting firm.

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Jennifer Glass: Ryan. Welcome to the show, and thank you so much for being here.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Thank you so much, Jennifer really appreciate being on the show.

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Jennifer Glass: Absolutely so, Ryan, let me ask you.

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Jennifer Glass: We had the field of Dreams idea, saying.

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Jennifer Glass: Come back, come back

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Jennifer Glass: into the fundraising world.

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Jennifer Glass: What was it about that? It in the fundraising side that made you decide you wanted to come back.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: So so first of all. I I should just mention you at the beginning in your in your intro You said that the not for-profit world whispered for me to come back

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: it. It didn’t whisper, it yelled and screams at the top of its lungs. It really did, you know. So you you mentioned that I spent a a decade or so in a commercial real estate finance. I still remember my interview. for that for that position after I had been in the not for profit world for for a number of years.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Where I sat down with the principle of the company, who I still to this day have a great relationship with, and I said to him, what exactly is commercial, real estate finance? I had no clue. and I still spent about about as as we said, about 10 years in that world.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: obviously learning a little bit more than not knowing from that interview about what the heck I was talking about to the point where I was able to close big deals, getting a lot of clients working with them, helping them with their with their properties, etc. But one of the things that was interesting is that, you know, I spent

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: those 10 years, really, as I say, making rich people richer. Thankfully. I was doing very nicely in the process, but I kept on feeling that Tug I kept on feeling that tug back into the Not for profit world, you know. One of the things I realized as an example

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: was, You know we sit around meals with friends and family, etc. And we all tell war stories.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and I realized that the war stories I was telling weren’t the stories about an attorney who helped close a deal, or an appraiser who, you know, who came in at the at the appraisal appraisal rate that we were really hoping for, and the banks that helped, etc., etc. Those weren’t the war stories I was telling, all the war stories that I was telling were bringing back on harking back to my first experiences as in in the not for-profit world, in my very, very first career out of college.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and that’s when I started realizing it wasn’t just a whisper.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: It really was very much a tug back into that world. because I realized that Yes, I was moving. I was making rich people richer, but I wanted to go back to enriching people’s lives as I did when I was in the Not for profit world before, and that was something that for me was really incredibly exciting.

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Jennifer Glass: and it’s great that you had that that it was calling you back, that it was harkening you back to come back into that space

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Jennifer Glass: I know for me. I was there, and I never really left.

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Jennifer Glass: because I’ve been working with organizations ever since.

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Jennifer Glass: when I worked at a university way back when and so it’s really all of that, that when you’re in it you realize you gotta keep doing more. It’s not like you can just walk away.

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Jennifer Glass: But

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Jennifer Glass: let me

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Jennifer Glass: shift a little bit. rH Strategic. The firm that you created

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Jennifer Glass: is there to help these organizations figure out some of the things that they can do when it comes to

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Jennifer Glass: the non-profit space.

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Jennifer Glass: So give me an idea. When people are coming to talk to you.

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Jennifer Glass: What is some of the problems, or what are some of the problems

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Jennifer Glass: that these organizations are facing? And how are you helping them navigate

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Jennifer Glass: the landmines? So they don’t end up blowing themselves up for otherwise getting injured.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: It’s actually a very interesting question. because I I I happen to very much believe that there is an an interface between the not for profit world and the for profit world.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: so as an example. while yes, I I I serve the not for-profit world. I’m still very much a business. i’m a for profit business, and my goal obviously is is

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: certainly to make money, but at the same time it’s it’s to it’s to help organizations reach the levels that they need to, and they should be reaching based on the incredible work that they’re doing. One of the things that I’ve I’ve always felt

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: is that not for profits

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I do not view themselves as businesses, even though they are not for profit business. They very often view themselves first as a not for profit, and the that business word doesn’t really even come into the into the scheme of things for a lot of them 150

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and that’s one of the things that I worked very, very hard to help them understand that while they Yes, they are a not-for-profit business.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: you cannot lose emphasis, and you can’t lose focus on that word business as well, because if you lose that focus on that word business, and what

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: all that everything that is entailed in that concept? the question is, will you be as effective as a not for profit, organization, business.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and my my my view is no. You need to think of things in a very strategic way. You need to think of things in a way that frankly, most not for profits simply do not think about. I mean in ways that they don’t necessarily think i’ll tell you as an example

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: in March of this year an organization a school approached me. they had a very, very interesting situation about their dinner coming up where they had what so what I would call a legacy honorary an honorary that was

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl and exceptional at at at every in every possible way. One, they were popular very, very well liked. Number 2 well respected number 3. They were willing to provide their lists of all their friends, all their family, all the people that this organization could reach out to as they were being honored by by despite, by the school, 150.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Not only that more important than all of that was that this was an honorary who was actually willing to pick up the phone and make solicitation calls to her friends, to her colleagues, to her family, whoever it may be, to really expand what the organization was doing, and they called me up.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and they said, Well, we’ve got this major opportunity here, and we’ve got this event. We need to put our dinner together, and we don’t know how.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and I started thinking about it, and I said, You know it’s very, very interesting. This is something that in my mind i’m able to do with relative ease. I understand the concepts, because i’m always looking things very much from a fundraising perspective.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: How can we turn this one conversation? How can we turn this one interaction that this particular honorary has.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and expand it, so that the that the organization is successful as as as a whole

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and helping the school think

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: very much from a strategic perspective, thinking in in ways that they haven’t necessarily thought of before. But again, honing in on the business side of things was something that would that was incredibly valuable to them, and gives me the ability not only to help that school, but to help multiple organizations when you’re thinking about it very much from a a holistic perspective. I’ve got to be honest with you. I couldn’t care less what color the napkins are at a dinner.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: It doesn’t make a difference to me makes no difference to me whatsoever.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: They can be orange, they can be pink, they can be. It makes no difference whatsoever. However, the one time I am concerned about the color of the napkins is, if I know

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl, and that one of the donors, an honoree, somebody who is involved in the organization and can make a major impact on the organization if I know that they absolutely hate orange napkins, 250

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl, and you can be sure there will not be an orange napkin anywhere in sight. But that’s important, because that’s thinking about it, not only from from the donor’s perspective, but really thinking about it from a business perspective one

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: we look at any product. If a product isn’t working in the way that it’s supposed to for a particular customer.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: What value does that

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: product have? The customer’s going to get rid of it and move on to the next thing, and I believe that the same applies in the not for profit world as well. we want to think about it from a business perspective about bringing those donors in and and working with them in it, certainly in a very compassionate way, in a way that a not for profit should but there’s so many things that interaction between business and and the not for-profit world, I think for me that’s what gets me so excited?

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Jennifer Glass: Hello! How you mentioned the color of the napkins as an example there, and it’s funny, because when

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Jennifer Glass: we do, our Chamber of Commerce centers very often we’re coming up with a theme for the evening when we work with the venue.

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Jennifer Glass: and so we’ll actually come up with the colors and the napkins. We’ll do all of those pieces, and I mean that becomes part of the actual evening, and how everything else builds from that level. But you’re right. It comes down to to somebody absolutely hate Orange, in which case you’re not

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Jennifer Glass: to do that. And the other thing that mentioned there was that nonprofits get confused about the Are they non profit of their business. Only difference is the tax status. They’re still a business. At the end of the day. They’re just registered as a 501 c. Organization here in the United States, and

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Jennifer Glass: different ways around the globe. But there’s still a business at the end of the day, and so it’s really important for them to keep that in mind, and called the

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Jennifer Glass: person giving you money, whatever it is. You want to call them a patient, a donor, a client, a customer, a guest.

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Jennifer Glass: whatever an investor.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Yes, and I love using the word investor because it’s the world. Yeah, right, it’s. But it’s not only the financial world. It’s, it’s you as not for profit. You are giving

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: your donors an opportunity to invest in what your not for profit does so. If they’re not just donors, not just supporting your work by being an investor. They’re a part of that work.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: They’re very much a part of it. They’re literally holding your hand through that entire entire process. Yes, you, as the organization, are the vehicle for allowing them to do the good that they’re doing, but without you, as the organization. Without them, With that partnership

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: nothing happens.

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Jennifer Glass: Could I have said it better? Thank you.

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Jennifer Glass: So let me ask you, Ryan, when we’re looking at these organizations.

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Jennifer Glass: and.

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Jennifer Glass: you know, let me actually take a take it a step back a little bit more.

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Jennifer Glass: Somebody’s got this

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Jennifer Glass: grand idea

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Jennifer Glass: about

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Jennifer Glass: working and setting up an organization for a

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Jennifer Glass: whatever it may be.

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Jennifer Glass: There’s a lot of things that they need to understand

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Jennifer Glass: in the beginning, when they’re thinking about setting up this organization.

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Jennifer Glass: Can you walk us through? Not at a

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Jennifer Glass: 1,000 foot level, but maybe at a 10,000 20,000 foot level? What are some of those things that these organizations really need to be focused on

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Jennifer Glass: as they are

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Jennifer Glass: embarking on this journey to set up

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Jennifer Glass: an organization

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: interesting question. you know, I I would, I would say that one of the very first things is to determine.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and this is this is standard business practice as well. but in in the not for profit world it it it. People often skip this step, and that is, is there an actual need for this organization that you’re thinking about to exist? Does another organization out there exist that’s doing the same work?

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: And what what are you bringing to the table? That’s a little bit different than any other organization. I’m actually dealing with a situation right now with the client where I mean they’ve They’ve been very, very well established for for many years 20 plus years, 250

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl and and another organization is actually coming in kind of trying to usurp their position and the the you know the the this. This first organization’s role within the community. that that second organization isn’t paying attention 250

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: to whether there is a need, whether they’re able to service the the the clients in a better way, and they’re simply not doing it.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: which is opened up a whole whole slew of challenges. for for for my clients, which we’re, you know we’re obviously working through. But the first question to always ask, and I think is, is there a need? Does it exist? that that that so many, not for profit start exactly

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: in that way? Does that need exist. Can we fill the need? so you know part of the way, I think to to really figure that out. is one, you know, Certainly. Just do research our friends at Google have the ability to to show us

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: the troves of information. that really is fantastic. But then it’s a matter of speaking to people within that community. Not only your friends, you have to talk to people who you may not necessarily like. You want to get honest feedback one

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and that, I think, is something that’s absolutely crucial with with, you know, without any doubt, to make sure that that You’re not doing something that you know you. You’re spending. You’re so passionate about this idea you’re so focused on it you get it up and running, and then you discover Hold on.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: there’s another organization that already does this. What if I spend all this time, all this energy, all this money sometimes? because it does cost money to establish a 5 or one C 3 you know. What what are we gonna do

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: the next? The next question that, I think, is always crucial to ask, and you’ve got to. You’ve got to pull emotion out of it, and that is.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Can this? What what are the needs of the organization from a financial perspective, and will we have the ability to ensure that in long term this organization not only succeeds, but thrives on behalf of the people who or the cause. that that that the organization was originally established in order to support

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and I think that those are probably the 2 most crucial elements without having that, you know. They say

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I think it’s the restaurant business that. Some some ridiculous percentage. i’m gonna say 50, but I think it’s significantly higher than that. but they say 50% of restaurants, new restaurants go out of business in their first year. not for profits can go the same way.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: yes, they’re not the tax ramifications. If you don’t, if the business doesn’t succeed, and of keeping a business up and running. There are not for profits out there that that don’t do anything, but they have been around for decades.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: but it still do nothing, because they they couldn’t get themselves off the ground. They couldn’t create the financial stability that was necessary in order for them to succeed, producing results for the course that that they were originally founded for so I think those are the 2 major things to always to to, to always look at from from from that perspective.

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Jennifer Glass: Thank you. And just a statistic that you might find interesting

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Jennifer Glass: is that, according to independent sector.org.

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Jennifer Glass: there are currently over 1.8 million non-profit organizations in the United States today

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Jennifer Glass: as of the day, this recording

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Jennifer Glass: that’s a do you know how many there are in Canada.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: How many something around 5,000

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Canada’s, Canada’s laws are are are significantly more restricted. And, by the way, when I say 5,000, it could be 6. It you know it. It’s not an exact number, but i’m i’m rounding Canada’s laws are a lot more restrictive. when it comes to the creation. The formation of an out for profit the United States is very, very liberal when it comes to you know, creating not for profit organizations.

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Jennifer Glass: and it’s like you are saying. I mean one of the things that I have been saying for so long

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Jennifer Glass: is that the Irs as part of its 501 C approval process really should be looking at. Is there already

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Jennifer Glass: an existing organization

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Jennifer Glass: that this organization is set up to. Do you think that’s a that’s the responsibility of government, though

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Jennifer Glass: I think that it is the responsibility. If people are giving money, and it is a charitable contribution that is, then a tax deductible receipt to the Government

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Jennifer Glass: that the Government has a responsibility to ensure that these organizations are running efficiently.

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Jennifer Glass: and they’re not running in a way that is going to be holding back

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Jennifer Glass: the mission instead of just giving salary to people. In other words, if somebody is saying that

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Jennifer Glass: i’m setting up another Parkinson’s Research Foundation as an example. Right? How many Parkinson’s organizations can there possibly be

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Jennifer Glass: right at the end of the day. If you have 30 organizations, and they’re each competing for salary or for donor dollars, and they’re paying salary to their directors and their employees and everything else.

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Jennifer Glass: What about the

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Jennifer Glass: actual mission of finding a cure for Parkinson’s?

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Jennifer Glass: What about the money that the Nih, the National Institute for Health

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Jennifer Glass: is giving to these organizations to help them in that process.

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Jennifer Glass: So i’m not saying that every organization individually would be judged the same as an example. A Chamber of Commerce

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Jennifer Glass: is going to be extremely different from a particular cause organization. And there’s a difference also in the legal categorization of the same perspective, too. A Chamber of commerce is a 501, c. 6 organization as opposed to a traditional nonprofit, which is a 501, C 3.

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Jennifer Glass: And so that is definitely going to be a major difference in that regard as well. But one of the things that the Government can certainly do is simple question on the form. How are you different from the other organizations out there?

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Jennifer Glass: If somebody can really put an answer on the 501 C file.

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Jennifer Glass: how they differ.

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Jennifer Glass: It may or may not be something that would stop them.

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Jennifer Glass: but at least they would know who else is in that space? In order to answer that question

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Jennifer Glass: properly.

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Jennifer Glass: and so

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: so I again I I i’m gonna i’m gonna to rough for a second, because I I do have to take a challenge you on this one, and that is that you know I I hear what you’re saying from from a conceptual perspective, however.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: is it? Is it the responsibility of the internal revenue service

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: to provide that that level of judgment. I understand the Nih. The Nih has multiple different Parkinson’s organizations that fall under its umbrella, or that that that are required to to provide feedback or or updates on what they’re what they’re doing.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: So they have a certain amount of control to to an extent.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: But I don’t know if the Irs, if it’s, if it really falls within their mandates to kind of get involved in something in something like that. because again, there there is. There’s there’s their focus is purely financial. But if you look at individual organizations, and i’m not talking about the the Major Parkinson’s organizations. But if you look at smaller organizations

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: within a community, you may have one or 2 or 3 organizations where there is overlap.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Not They’re not all necessarily doing exactly the same thing, although again, there there are sometimes

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: situations where they were doing almost the the exact same thing. However, they

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: there’s always nuance.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and the question is, is, the Irs sophisticated enough? No offense to the Irs actually

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: offense to the Irs. We Don’t care? Sorry. No, wait. The question is, is the Irs sophisticated enough? Is an Irs form sophisticated enough to really understand the difference between 2 different organizations that may appear to be doing very, very similar stuff, but really aren’t.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: because their their audiences are just slightly different. Their their what? Their their services are just slightly different, but not different enough, different enough within their community, but not necessarily different enough for an Irs form to to to to pick up the nuance.

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Jennifer Glass: So let me

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Jennifer Glass: play Devil’s advocate for a moment the Us. Patent and Trade Office

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Jennifer Glass: right every single time you file anything with the Us. Pto. You need to clearly say what is different about your

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Jennifer Glass: in order to get something that is given to you, As they say, they prosecute each application, and that’s actually the word they use. They prosecute each application

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Jennifer Glass: in order to

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Jennifer Glass: to find what is there as a novel concept or not a novel concept.

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Jennifer Glass: And so government is there looking at what it is that is going to say yes or no.

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Jennifer Glass: that is different

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Jennifer Glass: or not different.

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Jennifer Glass: In this case any irs potentially find something that is going to be different.

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Jennifer Glass: Yes, might they find things that are still overlap, and still grant the 501, C 3 filing. Sure.

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Jennifer Glass: if there is enough of a nuance in what the people say their mission is.

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Jennifer Glass: it would make many organizations.

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Jennifer Glass: I think, more strategically going into the creation phase of their organization.

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Jennifer Glass: and in the management phase of the organization, as opposed to starting up 30 organizations that are in the exact same space.

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Jennifer Glass: and so i’m not saying that the Irs is going to stop every single organization

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Jennifer Glass: from getting that approval. However, I believe that it will cut back on some of the organizations that are created simply to provide another salary.

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Jennifer Glass: There are many ways that you can partner with an organization

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Jennifer Glass: and be a driving component to what they are doing.

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Jennifer Glass: In other words, if you wanted to open up a local office of the Parkinson’s Association

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Jennifer Glass: you may be able to go to the Parkinson’s organization that you’re interested in, and I’m going to throw out Michael J. Fox’s Association as an example and say, All right, he’s based in New York.

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Jennifer Glass: You can potentially then get that office in La, where you are. His outreach

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Jennifer Glass: in La, instead of creating your own, because what you do there is you play off of whatever good will and value the existing organization has, instead of creating something brand new

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Jennifer Glass: where you’re trying to get new donors. There’s only so much money that the public has to be giving to these organizations at any given time

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Jennifer Glass: that would do that. And so that’s where my mind is in terms of that idea. But, I see your part also in terms of

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Jennifer Glass: Is it really the sophistication

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Jennifer Glass: of what these forms are about? And i’ll tell you i’m just we’re going through it. With an organization that I serve on

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Jennifer Glass: in terms of that 501, C filing and getting all of that done, and I mean being a trustee of my crime stoppers organization, how many crime stoppers are around there?

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Jennifer Glass: But again, we’re now 6 towns, and we’re expanding and getting more towns to come in. Is that really different? Yes, because we can’t cover every single town in the country or in the world, right? So there’s individual organizations that’s kind of the idea where that nuance is

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Jennifer Glass: right. So if you’re really specific in terms of who you serve, it’s a lot easier like you’re a food pantry, and you’re serving the

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Jennifer Glass: people in this community.

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Jennifer Glass: or you are

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Jennifer Glass: a greater food bank that serves a State right or the World Central Kitchen. Right there’s a lot different

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Jennifer Glass: ideas in that. And then again, you’ve got the individual chapters and from there. But, we’re kind of really veering far from

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: where we were going here. So so I think I think i’m going to make a comment that I think may actually bring us back to to to where we we we started. you know I I I happen to have the the the view, when it comes to to certain types of campaign, certain types of events, dinners, golf tournaments, various things that my that my consulting Company advises clients on One of the things in particular actually revolve around dinner committees.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and I happen to believe that that the bigger a dinner committee the better, and part of the thinking behind it. There are a number of different psychological reasons for it, but One of the one of the practical reasons to have a very, very large dinner committee is because there are those people who work, and those people who Don’t work.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: That’s standard that’s in any committee that’s in any on any board that’s in any organization that’s almost in any company My concern that I would have. If if

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl, and not for profits are regulated by the Irs and and the Ira, or any any government organization where they’re saying, Well, you can’t do this because somebody else does it 150.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: What’s to say that that organization is doing it Well, what’s to say that that organization is able to to keep up with all the various clients and and and and people that it’s. It’s supposed to service. Sometimes this is. There’s a finite amount of amount of resources that any one individual organization has.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and by spreading that that that wealth, by having more than one i’m not, certainly not saying.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: You know 2 2,000 organizations in one town just to deal with the you know, with with with, with, with homelessness. No, i’m not saying that at all. You have one, maybe 2, depending on different types of of of people. Different serving different needs within that community. but that’s something else. I again. It’s it’s it’s thinking on the on the micro level. what if what happens when not all those organizations are pulling their weights?

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and not all of them are doing the work that they’re that they’re supposed to be doing. They can’t be necessarily the regulations, and it’s they’re not doing anything legal. They’re just not providing the level of service at the level that one would think those clients need in order for them to be successful within that not for profit. So again a different way of thinking about it, I think

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Jennifer Glass: fair enough. So let me ask you a completely

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Jennifer Glass: different question, but related to your last point.

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Jennifer Glass: Let’s talk about Board Development

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Jennifer Glass: or Development is one of the key things. As we look at a nonprofit organization.

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Jennifer Glass: When you’ve got an organization you need an active board.

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Jennifer Glass: You need people who are really invested in the organization that are going to be doing what it is that you’re trying to do.

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Jennifer Glass: What are some of the tips that you have

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Jennifer Glass: in Board development? And you mentioned the dinner committee to?

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Jennifer Glass: I want to focus more on the board for the moment because the Board operates the whole year. The dinner committee operates for one of them.

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Jennifer Glass: So when we look at that board development, what are some of the things that we really need to consider

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Jennifer Glass: to help us build that board, if

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Jennifer Glass: you

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Jennifer Glass: and in a way that’s going to really help

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Jennifer Glass: organization forward.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: So I I think that the the possibly the most important thing that any board can do

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: is leave. Leave the ego at the door.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Ego does not belong in in in a board setting. and unfortunately you know more often than not you do see ego creeping in. You do see ego, you know, coming in where it it it starts

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: creating challenges for for the organization. By the way, it’s not only from the board side, sometimes it’s from the from the organization side as well, and I’ll, i’ll tell you an interesting story about that in in in a minute potentially depending how the conversation goes. But I think that’s the first, the first and foremost that that the ego has got to be left with the at the front door.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: in the Not for profit world. We talk about the 3 w’s of not not just with donors, but specifically with with boards and committees, and the 3 W’s are wealth, wisdom, and work

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and any organization needs all 3. In order to be successful. You’re not necessarily going to find all 3 components in any one individual. That’s that’s rare, but it does exist. but you need those people, of course, who are going to be bringing wealth.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and any donor is a person who brings wealth to to an organization. It doesn’t have to be a 1 million dollar check in order for for for wealth. You know it. A $20 check is also contributing wealth to the organization. there’s that wisdom. whether it’s it’s the wisdom of age, whether it’s the wisdom of of of of life experience, whether it’s wisdom of having run a major company and bringing those tools to to bear for the not for profit.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: There’s that that there’s that W. That that second W, that that wisdom, and the third is work

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: where you have board members who are literally roll up their sleeves. and they’re not afraid to to make calls to donors. They’re not afraid to, you know. We’ve got an events coming up. You need sweat, swag bags packed. What can I do to help? That’s part of it, part of it as well, you know. And again it’s rare to find all 3. But when you recognize that those 3 components are so so incredibly valuable, and for an organization to utilize those those those volunteers in the best possible

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: way based on their strengths, whether it’s wealth, whether it’s wisdom, whether it’s wealth and wisdom, whether it’s wisdom and work, whether it’s wealth and work. Those 2 sometimes go together as well. it’s it’s providing the best opportunities for the not for profit to move things forwards for their clients and for the people that they serve in the best possible way. Those, I think, are the 2 key, the 2, the 2

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Major Takeaways, the third takeaway that I would also have when it comes to boards is don’t be afraid about fundraising. It’s not that scary

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and the different ways to do it. You Don’t necessarily have to be the person to pick up the phone, helping helping your not for profit

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Professionals reach out to, to to donors, to open the door for other donors. you can go to a a a solicitation as a board member. You don’t even necessarily have to say anything but your very presence at that meeting

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: helps the professionals raise the money that they need to for the organization. and I think that that’s something that’s absolutely crucial that you know. Again, board board members very often or or too infrequently get involved in the fundraising that’s necessary, and they’re they’re generally the people who are able to open those doors.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: they they! They have to be given the ability to do it. They have it has to be made comfortable for them, but that at the same time they need to understand. There is an expectation that as Board members, this is what they need to do.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: because that’s the only way that an organization can be is really going to be successful.

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Jennifer Glass: Thank you. And it’s really important to keep those 3 W’s in mind wealth, wisdom, and work, because the more that you know exactly what you’re getting into the better it’s going to be. And, by the way that applies not only

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Jennifer Glass: for the non-profit boards, but the for-profit boards as well

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Jennifer Glass: I mean there’s a lot of value in those

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Jennifer Glass: board seats for the for-profit world, just as there is in the nonprofit world.

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Jennifer Glass: So, Ryan, you mentioned earlier

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Jennifer Glass: that there was a

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Jennifer Glass: story that you wanted to share about boards and

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Jennifer Glass: the development aspect. Can you share that with us again, please.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Sure, Sure, was actually a very interesting story. And and what what’s interesting about the story? I think it’s the it’s it’s an understanding of that intersection between business and the not for profit world. and i’m, i’m gonna tell it this way. there there was a I was working for an organization a a good number of years ago

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: where

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: i’ll be honest. The the the board wasn’t a particularly functional board.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I wouldn’t. I wouldn’t quite argue that it was completely dysfunctional, but it boarded on that. So again i’m not going to say the name of the organization i’m out of, you know, out of interest in protecting their anonymity.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: but we had a very interesting opportunity. There was a major major donor, not only of our organization at the time, but this was a phenomenal philanthropist this woman and her husband would typically give in in the millions of dollars every single year to organizations across the United States and frankly across the world. it was really, I mean having somebody like this in your courts

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit Ctl. And absolutely tremendous, and a very, very well-known person in in in in multiple areas, in in the not for profit world a very successful business, of course. Any or any organization would have absolutely loved, loved to have had to have had her on on their board 150.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: there was a situation that had happened where the an organization that was one of this major donors PET projects.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: had a Major PR issue not related to the donor at all. She discovered this afterwards, and it was actually phenomenally embarrassing for her, because not only was she the chair of that particular board for that for a different organization. But she had created the board. She brought all her friends on board her friends, who were willing to roll up their sleeves. Her friends, who were willing to provide with the wisdom that we spoke about her friends that

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: had to check books, and we’re willing to to to write out checks to support that organization

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl. And when she realized what had happened she she pulled not only all her funding. She pulled all her friends from that particular board, and I heard about it again. It was actually wasn’t just that i’d heard about it. It was something very, very public one

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and I remember going to the Executive direct of the organization that I was working for at the time, and I said, we have a golden golden opportunity here. this particular donor, who’s a donor of ours we know very, very well, is incredibly supportive of our organization in the most profound ways. 250.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: the organization that she was on the board of that she was the board chair of

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: has has really created a very, very difficult situation for her. I think this is an opportunity for us to ask her to join our board.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and the response came back, saying, Well, this particular donor is known to be difficult. She can, you know she’s demanding.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: To which my response was, that’s fantastic. When could we sign her up.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and the response came back: yeah, yeah. But but she has very, very high expectations, and it can be very. I’ve heard that it’s very, very difficult to work with her as a board member, to which I responded. Wonderful! When can I have her seat set up, and an office space set up.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Because this is the kind of person we we want to be challenged. We need to be challenged any business, whether they are for profit, business or a not for profit. Business has got to challenge themselves constantly, and this organization simply wasn’t willing to do it.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and part of it was that you know that that that fear of of having a board member who could actually one, not only bring real real gravitas to the organization, but bring

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: tremendous wisdom, tremendous, profound wisdom. This was somebody who, in her, her absolutely elegant gucci suits, would show up and literally roll up her sleeves and stuff envelopes with everybody else. This is the kind of board member you want. This is the kind of chair that you want on your board.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and it was phenomenally sad that they they wouldn’t take the plunge, and

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I think that if you were looking at any other major for-profit business they would have said

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: sign her up. When can we get her started? This is what we want, because it is something that is so crucial to the success of an organization. I look back, unfortunately, in that organization which is, which does a phenomenally amazing work, 150.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: But they’re not developing. They’re not growing. Had they taken the plunge

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and brought this yeah, maybe very, very difficult board member on board, she would have brought a whole cadre of people with her. the Board of Billy Cup would have become a lot stronger. The organization would have become a lot stronger had they been willing to take that. I’m not even considering it a plunge. It’s not. It’s. It’s it’s an educated decision

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: based on what is absolutely needed for that individual organization.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: We’ve got to think about it in different perspectives.

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Jennifer Glass: and it’s interesting to think about it in that regard. I know that

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Jennifer Glass: board a development on my side, for

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Jennifer Glass: guys serve on

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how

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Jennifer Glass: we run into.

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Jennifer Glass: so

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Jennifer Glass: do we take a particular on the board.

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Jennifer Glass: or do we stay away from those people on the board?

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Jennifer Glass: There is sometimes

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Jennifer Glass: battle, if you will

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in some ways is

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Jennifer Glass: well, we really don’t think this person would be on the board, because

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Jennifer Glass: the morale of the organization or the other on the board, even if they may be a worker, but they may just rub people differently. in that regard. And so it really comes down to. What is it that we’re looking at it? And how do we manage that process?

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: So we can really see all right. This is how we’re doing it, and where we go and things on those lines. Yeah. But, by the way, I should just say, personality is incredibly important.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: It really is. and I it this wasn’t on the board level. But I was working on an events a number of years ago. it was working for for a school at the time, and we were planning on putting together a major auction, and I brought 3 committee members together. People who I knew were just, very, very involved in the school. and I misread one of them. I misread one of them. 2 of the people with their gung. Ho! This is great. We’ve got ideas all the way. The the ideas are flowing where we can get. I

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: prizes, and we can get the, you know, auction items, etc., said it was phenomenal. And then there was this one person who just sat there in the meeting and said.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I don’t think it can work.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and just everything went downhill from there. So, having that personality that that that is is so crucial, making sure that you have a board of people who yeah do get along Yet you have to have

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: you have to have a certain amount of disagreement. A certain amount of disagreement is valuable. It really is. you know what? What? What’s the the the the the expression, but not an expression. When When President Lincoln put his cabinets together. he put his cabinet together, made up of of it was a cabinet of rivals, people who did not naturally get along with each other.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and it helped him reach the point that he did as as President, precisely because he was open to listening to other ideas. And I think boards need to do that as well. You have to listen to what other people are saying.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: And you have to have those personalities that do jive

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: again. They don’t have to get along perfectly, but at the very least are respectful to each other, and

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: constantly move that mission forward. And again you you mentioned the word ego again. Ego belongs at the door. It doesn’t belong in a boardroom.

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Jennifer Glass: and it’s really important. Also, you mentioned the

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Jennifer Glass: having people

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Jennifer Glass: that say no people that do have those

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Jennifer Glass: if you want, it’s really important whether you’re a nonprofit or a for-profit business

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Jennifer Glass: when you hire people

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Jennifer Glass: onto your team.

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Jennifer Glass: you want people a that are not

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Jennifer Glass: in the same skill set as you. You want differing skills.

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Jennifer Glass: and you also don’t want only yes, people

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Jennifer Glass: coming onto your team. You want those people who are going to push back and say, Are we doing the right thing? Are we doing it the right way? Because this was really going to help you continue to grow. And so it’s important to think about that, not only from the Board development, but also from the

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Jennifer Glass: perspective of what are you doing in terms of getting the right people in your organization, no matter how you’re set up? And so.

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Jennifer Glass: as we move forward in the

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Jennifer Glass: lifespan of the organization. So we’ve got the board. We’ve got the organization set up in the running of the organization set up appropriately. We know that there’s a lot that is there that we need to be thinking about. And then, of course, the fundraising to help us

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Jennifer Glass: with the mission that it is that we’re trying to do so as we look at all of what it is that we’re seeing in the nonprofit space.

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Jennifer Glass: What are some of the other things that an organization absolutely needs to be aware of or cognizant of. And

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Jennifer Glass: it’s operations.

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Jennifer Glass: As we look at wrapping up our conversation

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: from from an operational perspective, I, I would say.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: probably one of the most important things, certainly from from my perspective.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: is giving giving your team, especially the development team. the ability to the ability to take calculated risks.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: the ability to to look at a project, to look at a campaign and say

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: mit ctl. And can we do this differently. Can we do this better? Constantly re-examining how how you do things, and how you how you run your not-for-profit business 150.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: you know there there is. I I was working for a a school in in Los Angeles many, many years ago. That was part of my, as you mentioned, the 5 year stint on the West Coast.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: my very, very first board meeting I was brought in to to to to to give the board my my overall vision. for the for how the Development Department, which now fell on on my shoulders, how it was going to function or and what what? The plans were essentially for the first year.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I’m. So I gave a brief 5, 10 min presentation. The President didn’t want anything but to anything longer than that.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: But

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: one of the things that struck me, and this is this is the only time I’ve ever experienced this from from any board for any organization that I’ve ever worked with, and it’s something I encourage my clients to do, because I think it is so incredibly important. In front of the entire board. The President looked at me

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and said: Ryan, if you think that there is an idea

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: that you have that you believe will make money for our school, run with it.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: run with it. We know that not every idea you bring is necessarily going to work, but we want you to try. We want you to take risks, and I have to tell you that was music to my ears because i’m a creative person. I come up with new and interesting ways of doing things.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Not necessarily all my ideas. Sometimes i’ll take an idea that I saw that I absolutely love from the for profit world and say, Listen. This works phenomenally well in the Not for profit world. but the idea is to always come up with with with novel and new ways of doing things.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: and unfortunately so many, not for profits. When it comes to that operational side of things, simply Don’t, allow the the the fundraiser, the Development director, the Directive Institutional Advancement. Whatever the executive director, whatever their title may be,

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: they don’t always allow them to to to use that creativity and to and to run with that creativity. I still remember.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I I I ran. A campaign was actually at coincidentally at that school in La where the the year prior to me arriving, they would have this annual campaign, and that would take place in May and it would bring in between 15 and $25,000 a year.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: so I wasn’t hugely impressed with that. I said, we’ve got to do better. and I came up with a concept. It took me about 4 or 5 months to to to to get the President and the board to understand what we were doing. but I went from

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: let’s say, 25,000 the year before to half a 1 million

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: When I ran the campaign the following year because we tweaked it. We did it in a different way. I did it in a way that involved the entire community in a way that the school had never ever thought of running before, never thought of doing this way before.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: And had I not been given that that that that that that in premature to say, run with it.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: take a risk.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I I would never have succeeded in achieving that that that kind of

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: stratospheric results. I mean, it’s just, you know. It was absolutely tremendous. 25,000 to 500,000 from one year to another and again. It’s that when when organizations give their staff, their teams.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: that ability to innovate to come up with new ideas. And again, they’ll come back to that ego concept again a a not-for-profit leadership team cannot have ego involved

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: When, when, when when somebody, when it can be a an associate direct and assistance to Development director, who comes up with an idea it could be the idea that gets you from that 25,000 to that half a 1 million dollar range overnight.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: But you got to be open. You got to be listening. You got to be willing to listen, and and removing the ego is the very, very first step in order to to to achieve that. Again, we haven’t necessarily spoken practically what that necessarily means, but 250.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: I think that that’s a major major step that any organization can and should be taking. Will you take? Take a step back and say

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: It’s not about me as an individual? It’s not allowed to be about me as an individual. I’ve got to keep the organization in mind constantly, because when you do that, that’s when your team is able to perform at the highest possible level. You’re giving them the tools to do that. You’re giving them the the the

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: the the the the pad on the back, that little push to say. You’ve got this because you know what they do. People join the not for profit world, because they they’re passionate about why they about doing something bigger, doing something that’s more important than they view themselves as individuals.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: giving them that ability to take that that passion and run with it. Yes, sometimes it’s got to be tempered. There’s no question.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: but

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: often just let people run with those ideas.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Those ideas take flight, and along with them the organization takes flight as well.

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Jennifer Glass: and that’s a great way of summing it up. So, Ryan, let me ask you, how can people find out more about you.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Well, the first thing is they can certainly find me. on my website, rHStrategic.net that’s rHStrategic.net, and of course they can always find me on Linkedin. I’m always looking looking to meet new people on linkedin connecting with them, learning from them, learning from each other. and that’s probably the best way to find me, and looking forward to to to helping people out there who may need a little bit more guidance with their not for profit work.

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Jennifer Glass: Thank you. And there’s definitely a lot of organizations that can certainly be reaching out to you, Ryan, to help figure out what it is that they’re trying to do.

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Jennifer Glass: And how can they get more clarity

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Jennifer Glass: in their direction from what it is that they’re in need of doing. Many organizations are trying to sit there, and they’re operating very often in the dark. They’re not really sure what the problem is.

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Jennifer Glass: and it very often can be the difference, like you said, between the 25,000 and the 500,000 annual raise or

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Jennifer Glass: revenue donations, and whatever it is, you’re calling it to bring investments, investments. Yes, thank you. so how you bring it in, and it’s really going to be important. So, Ryan, thank you so much for

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Jennifer Glass: being my guest on the show today. I think that everyone got a lot of value. So thank you.

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Ryan Hyman | rhStrategic.net: Yeah, thank you. And please make sure that when people, if people do reach out to me to mention your name, so I have some context about where they heard heard about me. and really I again, I really really appreciate that you brought me on your show.

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Jennifer Glass: Absolutely. Thank you so much so as we wrap up. If you are running a nonprofit organization or you’re running a for profit organization, it really doesn’t matter at the end of the day the principles that we discussed in this episode

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Jennifer Glass: or valid, no matter how you look at it, whether it’s the ego at the door, or I call it the added to tree. When you walk into the office.

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Jennifer Glass: If you’ve got a bad attitude, you write it down, you post it on the tree outside the office, and if you want to take it home at the end of the day you can pick it up and take it back home with you, but it doesn’t come inside the office. You are going to be doing what you need to be doing inside the space at all times that you are going to be steering clear

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Jennifer Glass: of all of those potential landmines. Too often we get bogged down with the idea of oh, my God, I can’t work with this person. I can’t do that. No way am I doing this

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Jennifer Glass: because it seems too little or too much, or whatever it is? That’s not right. And so we really need to be thinking what it is that we are doing to further the organization’s goals again for profit.

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Jennifer Glass: nonprofit doesn’t matter. We need to be focused on the big picture. What is it that people are trying to do? And where do we go from there? The more that you can really be focused on what exactly it is that you are doing, the more likely it is that you are really going to be successful in the long run

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Jennifer Glass: on that note, Ryan. Thank you again for being my guest.

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Jennifer Glass: This has been another episode of MOJO: The Meaning of Life and Business, and until next time. Here’s to your success.